America inflated a massive housing bubble, but the Irish managed to build so many excess houses that they could house every Irish citizen and still have many left over.
Irvine Home Address … 26 LEWIS Irvine, CA 92620
Resale Home Price …… $620,000
{book1}
There's a tappin' in the floor
There's a creak behind the door
There's a rocking in the chair
But there's no-one seem there
There's a ghostly smell around
But nobody to be found
And a coffin inlay open
Where a restless soul is spoken
Don't understand it
Don't understand it
Michael Jackson — Ghost
Building houses that remain unoccupied is a terrible waste of societal resources. Houses are expensive. When we put hundreds of thousands of dollars of sticks, bricks, and labor into something of no benefit to anyone we get a temporary economic boost from the construction itself, but when no use if made of the final product, it is all a complete waste. We could have sent a hundred laborers out to dig holes then bury them back up and accomplished the same nothing.
This cycle repeats in California. In the early 90s, we had many excess housing units in fringe markets like we do today. The markets are different as the fringe markets moved eastward, but the effect is the same. There are many empty McMansions in eastern Riverside County, the High Desert and in housing markets all over the country.
For as stupid as we were here in the United States, the Irish make us look prudent and restrained.
Ghost estates testify to Irish boom and bust
BBC News, Republic of Ireland
David McWilliams is the man who coined the phrase "ghost estate" when he wrote about the first signs of a disastrous over-build in the Irish Republic back in 2006.
Now, it is a concept the whole country is depressingly familiar with. Most Irish people have one on their doorstep – an ugly reminder, says the economist and broadcaster, of wounded national pride.
"Emotionally, we have all taken a battering," he says. "Like every infectious virus, the housing boom got into our pores. You could feel it.
"You'd go to the pub and people would be talking about what house they'd bought. And now a lot of people, myself included, think 'God, we were conned'."
The Irish have reached a state of capitulation. We haven't. Most people you talk to here in California really believe house prices have bottomed and they they will appreciate back up to the peak in a couple of years. The totality of our failure has not reached the masses. In Ireland it has.
'Emotional thing'
Mr McWilliams paints Irish history as one of "economic failure".
"So to have risen so quickly and seemingly in the right direction and then to have that pulled away from us," he says, "it's more of an emotional thing than a financial thing."
That is the root of much denial in our own market. Failure is difficult to admit. Many people bragged about their financial genius and convinced others to participate in the madness. Now they find themselves hopelessly underwater and unable to admit their error. They cover it with anger and condescension.
There are 621 ghost estates across the Irish Republic now, a legacy of those hopeful years. One in five Irish homes is unoccupied.
If the country immediately used them to house every person on the social housing list, there would still be hundreds of thousands left over.
OMG! Empty out the homeless shelters by putting them into McMansions, and they still couldn't fill their housing stock. Squatting is not a problem there, I guess. Who would know or care?
It is difficult to comprehend that level of overbuilding. I remember living in Texas in the early 90s, and I was astonished at the number of empty office and retail spaces. They built a 20 year supply in a few years. Strip malls and office buildings were everywhere — all of them empty. It must be rather eerie to drive through modern subdivisions of empty houses.
The obvious question of who people imagined would live in all these new-builds makes Irish people wince now.
But hindsight is a wonderful thing. Only a few years ago, developers feeding money into local government coffers were getting free rein to build row upon row of five-bedroom detached houses on the green outskirts of towns nobody had even thought of commuting from before.
'Raised eyebrows'
Banks were throwing money at members of the public who saw these houses either as an escape to a better lifestyle or an investment route to riches.
Builders from eastern Europe were working overtime to create homes, the value of which was sometimes three times what it is now.
Sound familiar, doesn't it. How many people bought second homes for their retirement — houses that were to actually provide for that retirement with the inevitable appreciation? Everyone in California was a speculator, and many (if not most) took out this appreciation and spent it like income.
Instead of eastern Europe, we imported our labor from northern Mexico to build houses worth about a third to a half of what they were a few years ago. The pattern is the same, it is only a matter of degree.
As the slump set in, the immigrant workers went back home, the banks ceased lending on the scale that had fueled the frenzy and the market disappeared.
Property supply had become completely divorced from property demand.
County Leitrim alone would have needed about 590 new houses between 2006 and 2009 to accommodate its population growth. It got 2,945.
That sounds like most of the fringe markets here in the US. There are many small towns about 90 miles out of downtown Phoenix that saw huge numbers of empty homes built. South Florida is a wreck.
[empty neighborhoods in Ireland]
The resulting mess is currently being addressed by a nationwide audit of empty and unfinished housing.
It has raised eyebrows that precise numbers are not already clear, even to the local councils who gave planning permission for the homes in the first place.
'Everyone was buzzing'
Ciaran Cuffe is the Green Party minister of state in charge of the audit.
"It's one heck of a challenge", he says, "because we have the legacy of many years of poor planning, and an economy that was overheated, paid far too much attention to construction and was more interested in the quantity than the quality of homes".
Fortunately, we have stringent building codes here, and most of the bubble era construction is very good; however, we certainly got much more than was required.
He says the state's perceived wealth was part of the problem.
"I think there was a view that demand would continue indefinitely at a time when we had very high levels of immigration.
"People thought the housing was needed not only for the people of Ireland but also for others that had come here, and that this golden goose would continue to lay golden eggs for ever."
No matter how it is cloaked, the illusion of permanent prosperity is associated with every financial bubble. The roaring twenties saw a land boom and bust in Florida — there was only so much buildable land there, so certainly it would rise in price forever. We followed that with a stock market bubble built on the belief in the prowess of American industry. In the stock market bubble of the 90s, people thought tech stocks, semiconductors in particular, would rise forever. We were entering a new era driven by technology, or so we thought.
Nobody expects the majority of the Republic's surplus new housing simply to be ploughed down by the bulldozers now.
But Mr Cuffe admits some of the recent headlines in the Irish press on the subject are not completely wide of the mark.
"I certainly think demolition could be part of the solution in cases where we have housing estates that are unoccupied, that are miles away from where people want to live and that were badly built in the first place."
It is rare that houses are bulldozed, particularly new construction. Perhaps 40 year-old crack houses in Detroit, but new McMansions will be occupied by someone even in remote locations.
And indeed, many of the Irish ghost estates are in the unlikeliest, most isolated places.
It is strange, looking down vast rows of immaculate new-builds, taking in their optimistically-planted front gardens and peering through curtain-less windows into unwanted granite-topped fitted kitchens, to comprehend the fact that they might never be occupied.
Mr McWilliams says the whole of the Irish Republic is having to come to terms with what he compares to a collective addiction.
"Everyone took the property drug at the same time", he says, "everyone was up at the same time, everyone was buzzing.
"Now we are all in the middle of this huge comedown. And people are looking around and saying – 'what happened? Was that us?' And then we look at our bank statements and we realise – 'yes, it was'".
The end of a financial mania has all the symptoms of a severe hangover. Nothing is free in life, and when people act like it is, when they become entitled, life has a way of slapping them in the face.
Look at what the housing bubble has already done to our population. We have created a massive sense of entitlement, and everyone still wants to own a home — not because it is a place to shelter their family, but because they see it as their own personal ATM machine capable of giving them everything their greed desires. Lenders try to take advantage of this foolishness and give people huge mortgages. Those that sign up get to live a life of servitude endlessly feeding the beastly lenders. Those of us who do not want to play the HELOC game have to pay a 30% premium to provide shelter for our families because the ignorant HELOC abusers bid up prices. Great system.
Routine HELOC abuse
I have looked at enough of HELOC abuse properties to become convinced that HELOC abuse was considered a wise financial management tool by a broad cross-section of Irvine home owners. Day after day after day, I profle these. I have to go out of my way to find someone who didn't spend their home.
Hey, sellers, contact me if you didn't abuse your HELOC, and I will profile your property and call attention to your good behavior. A responsible borrower is hard to find.
- Today's featured property was purchased on 12/22/2004 for $610,000. The owners used a $488,000 first mortgage and a $122,000 second mortgage. There was no down payment.
-
On 2/13/2007 they refinanced with a $588,000 first mortgage and a $73,500 second mortgage.
- Total property debt is $661,500.
- Total mortgage equity withdrawal is $51,500.
- Total squatting is at least 6 months so far.
Foreclosure Record
Recording Date: 02/03/2010
Document Type: Notice of Sale
This isn't a bad case by Irvine standards, but then again, they did buy late into the bubble. While the rest of us were paying for our housing, their house was paying them.
Irvine Home Address … 26 LEWIS Irvine, CA 92620 
Resale Home Price … $620,000
Home Purchase Price … $610,000
Home Purchase Date …. 12/22/2004
Net Gain (Loss) ………. $(27,200)
Percent Change ………. 1.6%
Annual Appreciation … 0.3%
Cost of Ownership
————————————————-
$620,000 ………. Asking Price
$124,000 ………. 20% Down Conventional
5.16% …………… Mortgage Interest Rate
$496,000 ………. 30-Year Mortgage
$130,726 ………. Income Requirement
$2,711 ………. Monthly Mortgage Payment
$537 ………. Property Tax
$0 ………. Special Taxes and Levies (Mello Roos)
$52 ………. Homeowners Insurance
$0 ………. Homeowners Association Fees
============================================ 
$3,300 ………. Monthly Cash Outlays
-$467 ………. Tax Savings (% of Interest and Property Tax)
-$579 ………. Equity Hidden in Payment
$252 ………. Lost Income to Down Payment (net of taxes)
$78 ………. Maintenance and Replacement Reserves
============================================
$2,584 ………. Monthly Cost of Ownership
Cash Acquisition Demands
——————————————————————————
$6,200 ………. Furnishing and Move In @1%
$6,200 ………. Closing Costs @1%
$4,960 ………… Interest Points @1% of Loan
$124,000 ………. Down Payment
============================================
$141,360 ………. Total Cash Costs
$39,600 ………… Emergency Cash Reserves
============================================
$180,960 ………. Total Savings Needed
Property Details for 26 LEWIS Irvine, CA 92620
——————————————————————————.jpg)
Beds: 3
Baths: 3 baths
Home size: 1,856 sq ft
($334 / sq ft)
Lot Size: 5,642 sq ft
Year Built: 1979
Days on Market: 27
MLS Number: S612183
Property Type: Single Family, Residential
Community: Northwood
Tract: Othr
——————————————————————————
According to the listing agent, this listing may be a pre-foreclosure or short sale.
This property is in backup or contingent offer status.
NO Mello Roos! NO HOA dues! Award winning Northwood schools in Irvine. Walking distance to elementary. This beautifully upgraded home features 3 spacious bedrooms plus an office/den with built ins – could be converted to 4th bedroom, and 3 full bathrooms. Home upgrades throughout, bath surround tiles in showers, tile flooring, newer roof less than one year, spacious backyard, premium corner lot site and quiet neighborhood across to park. Convenient location with easy access to major freeways, employment hubs, shoppings and entertainment.
.
“Fortunately, we have stringent building codes here, and most of the bubble era construction is very good; however, we certainly got much more than was required.”
Nonsense.
Take a look at the crap outside of CA. The sacremento suburbs are going to be the most luxurious slums in the country. That hard wood and granite in a 3000 sq. ft. McMansion tenament is going to last a long time.
People here say this will decrease the prices in areas like Irvine. On the contrary it will make areas like Irvine even more premium to the alternatives. If you disagree with me then move to Riverside. If you aren’t willing to move to Riverside now you understand.
Everyone has a price.
Everyone is willing to live in Riverside, just at different price points. There is nothing price cannot fix.
Chuck
I completely disagree. Given what Riverside offers that vast majority of people with the money to consider buying in Irvine would never opt for Riverside.
Most of the readers of this blog would choose Irvine over Riverside. But your assertion that the Irvine premium goes up while other competing properties decline in value is beyond crazy. I recognize many of your comments are wishful thinking and justifying your own decision, but think for a moment about what you are saying.
If houses drop to $100K in Riverside or perhaps $300K in Lake Forest, you honestly believe that will cause prices to go up here in Irvine? Premiums are relative to alternatives, and the substitution effect is very real.
I can tell you from clients who have contacted us that a great many people would prefer Irvine, but when they see what they can get in Lake Forest or Tustin or some other nearby community they often buy there. The substitution effect works. It will continue to put pressure on rational buyers.
Now, if you want to argue that irrational people will continue to drive prices up in Irvine, I can’t argue with that. You are living proof.
I would choose Irvine over Riverside, but at the right price I would buy in Riverside.
Having seen the kind of people that live in Irvine, and tasted of their bile, I think that it’s about sixes for me.
There are some beautiful estates in Riverside… just check out some of the Riverside Bubble blog’s entries and you’ll know what I mean.
For me, it’s the commute that makes it not yet viable. But, if they’re giving away estates there, I’ll take one and live there. How much are the tolls now?
Chuck
A Castle in Corona? 🙂
http://lansner.freedomblogging.com/2010/04/07/a-10-million-castle-in-corona/61665/
The premium for high end goods will continue to increase as long as our economic growth continues to be based on bubbles. This has been an undeniable trend. The difference between the price of a Rolex watch and the cheapest watch continues to increase.
I agree that currently Tustin and Lake Forest are rational substitutes for Irvine. The premium between those areas can increase just as the premium for a Prada bag can increase as wealth disparity increases.
Chuck has made a good point. The problem with Riverside is that the prices are still to high for people to move there.
All you need to do is line up your potential Riverside neighbor with your Irvine neighbor to change your mind.
If that doesn’t change your mind try lining up your childs Riverside classmates with his Irvine classmates.
This will change your mind before you even consider commuting or the weather difference.
There is no apples to apples comparison. The premium is already far different than it was even 4 years ago.
Seriously, you somehow think that people are dispecable based on the neighborhood they live in?
It’s a self selecting process. You can already buy a house in Riverside for the same cost as your Irvine cash down payment. Really how much cheaper does it have to get?
PR,
People who live in Irvine are just like the people who live in Riverside, only their zip codes are different. To somehow deduce that people in Irvine are in some way superior to those in Riverside is hubris.
Riverside has some beautiful land and homes. It seems like you say the worst home in Irvine is better than the best home in Riverside. That’s being divorced from reality.
Chuck Ponzi
“If that doesn’t change your mind try lining up your childs Riverside classmates with his Irvine classmates.”
You are so out of touch here. So let’s say you will buy in Riverside. Will you go to one of the predominately minority neighborhoods and buy? No. You will buy in one of the neighborhoods that you feel comfortable and you would then feel comfortable with your schools. In any city or neighborhood, if your kid wants to hang around with losers, that is because he has something in common with them. You should stop talking about things you know nothing about.
irvine kids have faster cars and better drugs. each generation increasingly moves away from its old culture frugality. Germans, Chinese, you name it. I think i am pretty cheap, but grandpa puts me to shame.
The desire for younger generations to squander wealth is strong. i think we will be forced to change in the future.
I agree with PR. It’s not about good humans and bad humans, it’s all about MONEY. Where there is money, there is good schools, good social upkeep, and usually a higher inclination to get further education.
The funny thing is, all the people saying “How dare you say something like that?” are the exact same people who would NEVER move into a piss poor community like most of the IE has become.
Our school system caters to the lowest common denominator (no kid left behind!!!) and do you think the kids in Irvine or the kids in IE will be at a higher education level for their age?
Like PR said, it is inevitable. Personally, I just see this as a manifestation of the two class, two party system I see being enacted in America.
My education received in a rural Iowa public school is not that much different from the best schools in Irvine. The motivation to do well is not different either.
It matters not how much money you have, but your access to quality education at a price you can afford.
many here want to invoke the china mirage. Fine, look at china. People there also gain excellent education while having little money.
Money does not rid one of stupidity. One only need look at Irvine to confirm that simple truth.
Chuck Ponzi
I have to agree with Planet here. I have been in Irvine for 7 years now renting.
The main reason I live here is the convenience. My work is just 10 min away and I can come home as I please to play with my newborn baby. All my friends are close by also.
I doubt I will move to riverside at any cost. For me life is too short to be spent commuting, I would rather spend that time with my Family even though there is a financial cost to it.
I would not commute either, but at the right price I would work in Riverside, or retire. I do not know the names of the streets or nighborhoods, but there are some $mil neighborhoods there. The neighborhood my mom grew up in, Casa Blanca, is not one of them and I do know the street names there.
Sorry… even at $1… I wouldn’t live in Riverside. It’s not just about price… it’s location too… closeness to friends, family, work and play.
I think some of you are not being honest here, homes in Riverside are already cheap enough to buy and pay less than it would to rent a 1BR in Irvine. Why haven’t you moved yet?
Upheaval of your life isn’t just about dollar per sft.
And while some may find Lake Forest and Tustin as a good substitute… I don’t think those areas are discounted enough. Summit Crest in Lake Forest has brand new 3000sft homes for $700k with no Mello Roos… yet we would probably rather buy a 2100sft motorcourt home in the dense 2010 HK Collection.
This is very true. There are some fairly high end, new neighborhoods in Riverside, such as Mission Grove, which would be indistiguishable from Irvine (other than larger lot sizes). The schools in these newer areas are on par, or damned close to it, to Irvine’s (although I think this is due to students and their parents as opposed to anything actually being special with their schools-or Irvine’s, for that matter). There are also some high end historical neighborhoods, such as Wood Streets and Victoria, that don’t exist in Irvine, but would not be that out of place in something like Beverly Hills.
There is also a “barrio” (Casa Blanca) and a “ghetto” (Eastside). I would not want to live in either neighborhood for a wide variety of reasons.
I live in one of the neighborhoods that is in between the two extremes.
Riverside also has it’s own little “ghost estate”, Riverwalk Vista, on the corner of Indiana and La Sierra, across the street from the La Sierra Metrolink station. They graded the lots, built the clubhouse and pool and a couple dozen houses, then boarded everything up and it’s just sat vacant for about three years now.
I disagree about the durability of hardwood and granite. Even the highest quality (and maybe this stuff wasn’t really the best of the best) stains, chips, degrades when it’s not the owner and someone who worked long and hard to pay for it, who is using it. In some ways I think it is even more sensitive than cheap things, because who wants a nice, expensive granite counter top … with a crack or a stain in it?n Or a hardwood floor with a deep scratch or burn marks?
Ok Planet Stupidity. You’ve finally proven beyond a shadow of a doubt what a moron you are.
Where the fuck did I say anything about Irvine?
That’s right. Nowhere.
Quality construction isn’t about hardwood floors and granite countertops you fucking dolt.
Oh…BTW. I have absolutely no desire to live in Irvine. I read the blog because it’s funny.
The bubble-era construction was done very, very poorly. I thought IR was joking when he wrote that. It was all done on the cheap with underskilled labor and Chinese drywall. Sure, there was some Pergo flooring and marble countertops put on, but the underlying construction is bad — bad materials, bad labor.
I do kind of understand your reasoning about truly premium areas maintaining or even increasing their premium. IR’s Brazil slum/deluxe apartment pic shows one example of how that might work. But I don’t believe that Irvine is “truly premium.” Hollywood hills? Sure, that’s for the truly rich. Irvine is for professional class workers, and without lending, the premium won’t hold. Honestly, even Rolex is not “truly premium.” If you want to see a premium watch, look at Patek Philippe or Jaeger-LeCoultre.
I have no desire to live in Irvine either. I have no vested interest in Irvine. I do recognize that a premium in Irvine exist. I’m also fascinated by the trend of increasing premiums versus cheap substitutes. When you have a true substitute you don’t have anyone complaining about the premium since they have already purchased the substitute and have moved on…
Actually the Chinese drywall problem was limited to most of the southeast corner of the US.
I don’t tend to agree with PR but if you look objectively I agree I would not move to Riverside.
(I also am not going to choose Irvine either). I live close to the coast because of the convenience of work but there are other factors.
The air quality, and I like the outdoors a lot, is better, the schools in general are better, and the crime rate is lower here than in Riverside. All factors that keep me here and leasing a smaller place than buying a Mcmansion inland.
The global bubbles have been much larger than the US housing bubble. The Japanese asset bubble was significantly larger than the US. This is exactly why the US is in such good shape. Relative to everyone else the US is bad at blowing bubbles.
The US is in excellent position as there is only one pallatable way out for all of the politicians and banks around the world: the inflation beast. The politicians and central banks need not worry as they control the CPI calculation. While inflation soars to evaporate the debt, the CPI will sit pretty at 3%. Inflation will be worse in other countries. The US bubble is smaller, the US has a lower debt to GDP ratio, and US debt is viewed as a safe haven.
Yep, look at China. That country is in full bubble-mode with no end in sight.
There are a lot of countries with a debt to GDP ratio that is lower than the US. Mexico being one of them. But your right Japan is right next to Zimbabwe.
By far the largest bubble, interest rate swaps, is held by US institutions. When interest rates in the US go up by more than 2 points, the interest rate swap OTC derivatives based on US debt will implode leaving US crrency as trash.
Sorry, 200 points and currency.
200 points LOL are you sure? When do you expect the circular reasoning of your theory to occur?
What do you think 200 points is?
LOL the absurd arrogance makes it even better.
Are you willing to accept that if a mere 200 points led to the collapse of the currency the currency would have already collapsed?
The notional value of outstanding OTC interest rate contracts as estimated by the BIS is about $500 trillion. A 100 point change in interest rates would cause a transfer of $5 trillion, the vast majority of which would be in default. The notional value of all the credit default swaps existant that brought the financial world to a cliff was less than $20 trillion in 2007.
Darn, I almost forgot. That $500 trillion of interest rate contracts are written on a total bond amount of $82.2 trillion.
You still didn’t answer the question. Let me change the question for you:
If I were to flip a coin, heads the currency collapses, tales the currency does not collapse, doesn’t the currency collapse before my coin flip?
You are missing a key point in your logic.
Gross or net? The great majority of outstanding contracts net out. Still, on a net basis, it’s large.
what % of GDP is based on consumer spending? 70%?
at a certain point, no amount of CPI manipulation can hide soaring inflation, people see it at the store and gas station.
inevitably rates will rise and what happens to consumer spending?
and what happens to the cost to service our debt when rates rise?
You are using rosy GDP numbers and assumed perpetual confidence to make a statement.
I do agree with some of your points however.
Not sure if you saw this article from The Atlantic entitled
“The Next Slum?
The subprime crisis is just the tip of the iceberg. Fundamental changes in American life may turn today’s McMansions into tomorrow’s tenements.
The Next Slum
thanks. interesting article.
that “newer” graphic is hilarious and disgusting at the same time. If Orange County needed a new flag, it should just be a picture of that lady. Describes OC perfectly.
All that roasted flesh – it’s like an overcooked version of the “turn key” graphic.
That’s not flesh, it’s skin over silicone.
Like a granite counter top in an older tract house?
…so to speak.
don;t knock it ’til you try it
I thought that poor lady was a cancer victim with a double mastectomy. I hope she’s alive and happy somewhere, no matter what your opinion of her looks may be.
Turtle Rock Resiliency
I have some insight into the T Rock discussion from yesterday – I’ve been renting here for over 3 years. I was just informed by my landlady this weekend that her primary residence in Redlands is being foreclosed so she has to move back into my unit.
A neighbor had put down $20K on a property in another city just before the market fell. He realized he couldn’t sell his unit here for what he wanted so he forfeited the $20K and stayed put.
So since this neighborhood is older a lot of the places are paid for and these owners are staying put for now or using them as fallbacks. Granted, these are the cheapest units in the area.
So even though I have acted responsibly I’m personally getting screwed because I have to pay for a move I don’t want. I was planning to move only when I purchased a place. Now I have to move to another rental then move again when I purchase.
Patience,
Such is renting. The real advantage of renting is that you can move with little recourse. The disadvantages are that you’re always priced at the margin and you don’t have control over whether you have to move or not after the contract term is up.
I’ve been renting for nearly 6 years after selling at what I thought was the bubble top. 2 times I chose when to move (new jobs), and the 3rd was induced by a out-of-touch landlord who wanted to raise the rent irrationally at the height of the biggest recession in history… it subsequently sat for 6 months and rented for less than what I was paying. Nearly 2 years later, he’s back asking nearly the same rent I paid back in 2005. That’s at least 5 years (and my landlord said since 2002 rents haven’t changed on that unit) of stagnant prices.
I’d rather be a renter for the forseeable future. Even with all of the crap. It’s still better than owning.
Chuck
I find that even the more hopeless landlords appreciate a renter who keeps the place clean and pays on time each month.
It helps if your landlord has had to deal with a non-paying flake. My current landlord is so happy to get the check on time that he leaves me alone.
Sure, it can end at any time, once the lease is up, but the feeling of being able to move without paying realtor commissions is one I cherish.
I may rent for the rest of my life.
Doode. I saw that “Newer” picture some time ago and thought I had applied enough eye bleach to get rid of the image. Thanks for resurrecting that horror. I’ll get you back some day.
Scan your resources for any 15 year amortization loans and you’ll likely find some responsible homeowners out there. What would be sad is if there is a 15 year loan, plus the HELOC, that was spun out of control for same reasons everyone else had done.
My .02c
Soylent Green Is People.
I was playing around with my hobby stuff and I dropped my soldering iron right on the webby part between my thumb and my index finger. I got a nasty blister from the burn. That’s *exactly* what her fake nasty boobs look like to me.
It looks more like large welts.
TX, c.a. 1980’s, had a lot of knock downs on commerical RE building and some apartment building. The upkeep cost and taxes were more than the rents. The tax law depreciation schedule change did help either. Liability was also an issue on the zero or near zero occupancy buildings.
On friend made very good on renovating crack houses. Evicting the the druggies and dealers and renovating in the 1970’s to 1980’s. He had the help of the police being in the family and mayor’s office. Definately not for the timid.
Fire up them bulldozers.
freedomCM,
Aren’t the HOA liens wiped out on a FC? Even if the HOA perfects the lein, they must also payoff the first and others upon sale of the property and the HOA is likely to be left with only a legal bill.
The paying HOA people will be forced to make up for the squatters and banksters.
LongBeach Renter,
HELOC adn HEW are just financing mechanism for terrorist on a shoe string.
Reading yesterday’s TR post, I began to wonder what is going to happen to all the houses that are being squatted in with the bank’s approval, the shadow inventory. Not when they will finally be taken back and sold, though. But what will happen when they need a new roof? When the water heater craps out? when a pipe bursts? A slab leak?
Are the squatters going to spend a few grand on repairs?
Also, in Irvine, what will happen when will the HOA fees not paid result in a lein by the HOA? What will the bank do then? Wont that force their hands?
Finally, in IR’s expenses, above, it looks as if the budget for repairs for this 30 year old house is $800/year. How realistic is that?
Just read that the Times Square terrorist was also a HELOC abuser:
“In Shelton, Shahzad bought a house at 119 Long Hill Ave. in 2004 and took out a $218,400 mortgage from Chase Home Finance. In February 2009, he obtained a $65,000 home equity loan from Wachovia bank and seven months both banks began foreclosure.”
http://www.ctpost.com/news/article/FBI-searches-home-of-suspected-bomber-473341.php
I finally understand why everyone is so upset about terrorism: it can lead to HELOC abuse. Hell, if I were a HELOC abuser, I’d probably tell my family that I actually earned the money as a terrorist.
Terrorism is one thing, but HELOC abuse is another order of magnitude entirely. Shoot this piece of filth!
No, no, he was a HELOC abuser before he became a terrorist. The cause and effect goes the other way! 😉
Newer.
should i try to clean the barf from my keyboard or just buy a new one?
Take Moreno Valley it appealed to a lot of hispanics and afro-ameicans who wanted to get out of the barrio or the ghetto in Orange County -Santa Ana-Anaheim or Los Angeles County. But, the roof fell out. One Mexican that moved there like it compared to Santa Ana -Anaheim where almost all people were hispanic and had higher crime.